Interview with 19 Year Old Sentenced to Execution

Interview with Saber, a 19 year old on death row

They pull the stool out from under his feet. The noose presses against his throat and he hangs like a dancing puppet attached to an invisible string. He makes a choking noise, his feet moving around quickly in the air as he struggles. A few seconds later, he is motionless, as if a large pair of scissors had cut the invisible strings attached to his body.

Hamshahri Monthly, as quoted by Farda News, reports that the scene [of execution] haunts Saber’s thoughts every night as he is about to go to sleep. In the mornings, he fearfully wakes up to the image of the guards who will take him to the solitary room before his execution.

Saber has been anxiously expecting the gallows since he was 15 years old, when he allegedly killed a man in a street fight. His death sentence has been upheld, and at the age of 16, he was transferred from the Rehabilitation Centre (for juvenile offenders) to Rajai Shahr prison located in Karaj (a suburb of Tehran).

Saber has been living in a cell that is less than six square metres (70 square feet) for more than three years until he reaches the legal age for *execution. Perhaps that is why, when I stated that I wanted to talk to him on the occasion of Norooz (Iranian New Year), he smiled bitterly and said, “Norooz? Here?”

*[Translator's note: Iran executes juvenile offenders after they reach the age of 18. In fact, this practice is in violation of the UN's Convention on the Rights of the Child, to which Iran is a signatory. According to the Convention (section 37), death sentences should not be issued and/or carried out for crimes committed under the age of 18.]
In this conversation with Saber, we talked about life, love, and the gallows. We do not know whether he will have been executed by the time you read this. These words are probably Saber’s last gift to his mother who lives in the city of Behshahr (in the province of Mazandaran). His mother would cry every time we contacted her to ask for photographs of Saber. Between her sobs, she would ask us if we had any news on her son’s execution.

Question: Saber, do you ever have dreams of being executed?

Saber: Dream? What can I say? I do dream, but I forget them, as though I have Alzheimer’s. I am constantly in an imaginary and dream-like state. I fall asleep deep in those thoughts, and I will wake up suddenly in the same state. I don’t remember what the dreams that make me wake up suddenly are. Once they took me for execution, but the name of my father was misspelled in my file, so they returned it for correction [and thus postponed the execution].

Q: How many times did you have to reconstruct the murder scene?

Saber: None.

Q: Are you reminded of it often?

Saber: Yes, a lot.

Q: When you are remembering, do you get the feeling of “I wish” [regret]?

Saber: Yes, of course.

Q: How many years have you been in prison for?

Saber: Four years and a few months. On April 7, 2010, I will be 19.

Q: What happened on the day of the incident?

Saber: It was August 18, 2005. My cousin, who was serving in the military back then, and I were on our way to see his sister in Pakdasht [in the province of Tehran]. On our way, we boarded a white Peykan (an Iranian car), and my cousin and the driver began to argue over a simple and trivial matter.

Q: How did a simple matter turn into a fight?

Saber: My cousin told the driver, “Turn down the sterero, we are trying to have a conversation here.” The driver replied, “We want to listen to the music loudly. Do you have a problem with that?” Then the matter escalated into a fight.

Q: How did the fight result in murder?

Saber: The driver got out of the car with the steering wheel’s lock in his hand. He came toward me. He beat me up and I was lying on my back on the pavement. I stabbed him with my knife. Then I picked up my school bag and ran away.

Q: You were attending school?

Saber: No, but I had a school bag. I was nine when I lost my father. I didn’t study beyond middle school. It had been a year since I had dropped out. I was working in a metal shop.

Q: Did you flee the scene of murder?

Saber: I wanted to escape. Some people caught up to me and beat me. They told me [the taxi driver] died and accused me of “premeditated [murder].” I replied that it was an accident.

Q: The driver was 30 years old and was heavy-set. You were 15, and probably a smaller guy. How were you able to kill him with that stab?

Saber: I don’t know. The judge said to me, “You threw the knife at him. There were marks on his hand.” But for the past five years I have been saying, “I did not stab his hand.” One of the judges only asked me, “Did you or did you not stab the victim?” I answered “I did, but only once to his side.” There were four of them, but we were two. I asked the judge, “Why don’t you ask any questions to the people who accompanied the driver?”

Q: What happened after [you were arrested]?

Saber: I was afraid. They transferred me to jail blindfolded and in shackles. They hung me from my wrists. Once every few hours, they would beat me up. Look, you can still see the marks from the handcuffs on my wrists. Later when the magistrate saw the wounds on my hands, he got upset and asked, “What is that?” The officer told me, “Say they hit you during the fight [with the taxi driver].”

Q: If you didn’t have a knife, the murder probably would not have happened. Why were you carrying a knife?”

Saber: Our neighbourhood is very unsafe. It wasn’t possible not to have a knife. I was young and had to defend myself. That knife looked very nice. Actually I had bought it because I liked its design.

Q: Before this incident, have you ever been involved in any other fights?

Saber: Yes, but not with a knife.

Q: Did you have a knife and you didn’t use it?

Saber: No, I didn’t have a knife then.

Q: After the incident you were sent to the Rehabilitation Centre (for juvenile offenders), and you were supposed to stay there until you reach the age of 18. Why did you go to Rajai Shahr prison when you were only 16?

Saber: I wrote a letter requesting the transfer. I even made a little trouble once or twice to force them to transfer me. I did not want the family of the victim to feel that I was enjoying myself at the Centre which was not really like a prison.

Q: What was the Centre like?

Saber: It was like a park. Out of 250 people there, 10 to 15 were charged with murder. Most of them were released, or the family of the victim gave consent, or they were acquitted.

[Translator note: In Islamic Sharia law, the family of a murder victim has the right to choose between Qesas, an eye for an eye (execution), or blood money in exchange for sparing the life of the accused.]
Q: What kind of place is Rajai Shahr prison?

Saber: It is a big prison with big metal gates. There are five wards, and each ward has three halls. The length and width of the cell I share with [another prisoner] is no more than two or three footsteps. We have a small oblique window from which we can see the sky. We do not wear prison uniforms.

Q: There are many dangerous criminals held at Rajai Shahr prison. How do you spend your days?

Saber: I re-started school. I am now in the final year of middle school.
Q: Then, most likely, you will start high school next year?

Saber: If everything work out and I am released, I will continue school, if not…

Q: Besides school, how do you pass your time?

Saber: By praying, crocheting, and talking with other prisoners.

Q: Did they set up the Haftseen table in prison (decorative table set up for the Iranian New Year)?

Saber: Norooz here is like any other day. Nobody sets a Haftseen here.

Q: Do you believe in miracles?

Saber: Yes.

Q: Have you ever seen a miracle?

Saber: Only once. In Mashhad (a holy city in northeast Iran), a paraplegic was cured.

Q: Imagine a miracle happens in your case and the family of the victim decides not to choose Qesas. How will you restart your life?

Saber: The right way.

Q: What do you mean by the “right way”?

Saber: I mean that I will return back to metal work and I won’t engage in fights.

Q: Do you think they will forgive you?

Saber: I don’t know.

Q: If you were in the shoes of the victim’s family, would you forgive the murderer?

Saber: I can’t imagine to be in their shoes. It’s really hard.

Q: If you had a son who had been killed in the same manner in a fight, would you forgive the murderer?

Saber: What I did was not premeditated. I didn’t want to use my knife, I didn’t want to kill anyone. It was a simple accident that ruined my life. If the murderer was in the same situation, I would forgive him.

Q: If you are released, where would you go first?

Saber: Karbala (a holy site for Shi’ite Muslims located in Iraq). I wouldn’t go to my home. I would go to my sister’s house and go to Karbala from there.

Q: How many siblings do you have?

Saber: I am the only son and I have four sisters. Two of them are younger than me. My mother comes to visit me every month. My sister visits me once every month or every other month.

Q: What do you miss the most in the world outside prison?

Saber: I didn’t see anything out there. I haven’t missed anything. Only…I feel sorry for my mother.

Q: Why?

(Saber is quiet)

Q: If there were only one hour left until the end of the world, how would it pass for you?

Saber: I would ask for forgiveness. I would talk to my mother. I want to spend that entire hour talking to my mother.

Q: When was the last time you cried a lot?

Saber: The last time I was in court. I saw my brother-in-law after three years. He burst into tears and I began to cry as well. It was the court that upheld the death sentence. We cried outside the courtroom.

Q: Do you want to be born again?

Saber: No! If life would be the same way, no.

Q: What is your worst nightmare?

Saber: The gallows.

Q: If you could be anybody in the world, who would you choose?

Saber: I would want to be my maternal grandfather.

Q: What a choice! But why?

Saber: So that I could change my mother’s name.

Q: What is your mother’s name?

Saber: Zeynab. I told my grandfather and mother as well. Probably the reason my mother suffers so much is her name. Most Zeynab’s have a painful life. That is a Zeynab’s fate and this is Saber’s.

[Translator's note: In the Qur'an, the name Zaynab refers to Zaynab bint Ali, the granddaughter of the prophet Muhammad]

Q: When I was looking for your photos, your mother said that in the last five years, she has had no photos of you. Why is that?

Saber: It has been five years since the last time I was home. I even took my older photos from my mother. I took a picture once or twice in prison. Have you seen the picture of Behnood Shojaee in a red shirt; the picture on his grave? That is my shirt. That day we took pictures together.

[Behnood Shojaee was the juvenile offender executed last fall despite an extensive campaign to stop his execution which was against Iran's international commitment under the Convention on the Rights of the Child]
Q: You were friends with Behnood?

Saber: Yes. He would always say, “Saber has grown taller in prison.” They finally hanged him. The first time they took him for execution, I was going for execution too, but I was returned, because as I mentioned, they had misspelled my father’s name.

Q: Do you miss Behnood?

Saber: Yes. Many of my friends have been executed.

Q: Make a realistic wish..

Saber: That all the sick be cured.

Q: That was very general. Say one that concerns you.

Saber: I have no wish for myself.

Q: Don’t you want to be pardoned?

Saber: God should wish that.

Q: Now, a wish that cannot come true?

Saber: I wish that time would go back to August 18, 2005 (the day of the murder), but I wouldn’t have a knife.

Q: A dream?

Saber: I wish to open my eyes and find myself in Mashhad (the holy city in northwestern Iran).

Q: Have you ever fallen in love?

Saber: Yes, and she was more miserable than I was.

Q: Who?

Saber: Forget it! These talks are not good.

Q: Has she gotten married?

Saber: No, I don’t think so.

Q: Your lawyer says you’re a good guy, but an incident has ruined your life..

Saber: He sees goodness in everyone.

Q: What is goodness in your eyes?

Saber: I don’t know.

Q: I am going to say some words, and you tell me your feelings about each one. Let me start from the worst, for example, gallows?

Saber: A nightmare that repeats every night.

Q: Prison?

Saber: Waste and destruction of a person’s life.

Q: Victim of the murder?

Saber: I am sorry.

Q: Murder?

Saber: The biggest tragedy of my life.

Q: Knife?

Saber: Never carry one.

Q: Life?

Saber: It had a bitter end.

Q: School?

Saber: I miss it.

Q: Love?

Saber: Write “sigh.” Just put down “sigh.”

Q: Mother?

Saber: She is not happy.

Q: Regret?

Saber: Endless.

Q: Do you fear death?

Saber: Yes and no. I don’t fear it myself, but I am afraid for my mother who will be alone after my death.

Q: Have you ever heard of the prison cell where they take the person scheduled to be executed a day prior to the exectuion?

Saber: Yes, it is a hall..

Q: A dark hall?

Saber: What difference does it make if it is dark or lit?

Q: What would you do 24 hours prior to your execution?

Saber: (long silence) I would sleep and read the Qur’an. What else can I do?

Q: What do you think the execution ceremony would look like?

Saber: They take you to the gallows and ask the victim’s family, “Do you pardon or not?” If they say no, they hang you.

Q: What do you think would happen to you after you die?

Saber: When I was really young, I used to think that I would turn into a new person, and I will be reborn again. However, now I think that if I die, someone else like me will be born.

Q: If you could change a bad event in your life, which one would you change?

Saber: I would do something to prevent my father’s death. If my father was around, I would definitely go to school out of fear for him, and none of this would have happened.

Q: What do you think is the first feeling people have after they die?

Saber: I think after death, you will have no fear. Once your life is taken, it is as though they have ] extinguished the fire. You are relieved. Have you listened to Siahat Gharb?

[Siahat Gharb is a book by Mohammed Hossein Najafi Ghoochani).
Q: Do you listen to it?

Saber: I listened once, I was really scared. Apparently, after death, one sees their own body first.

Q: You go to bed every night with the thought of the gallows, and wake up in the morning with the terror of death. What does this constant fear feel like?

Saber: The day you wake up and realize the time for the execution has not arrived, you will be rejoiced at the fact that today you will not die, and you have the right to live. But when they bring up the topic of execution, it is really crushing. The first time they took Behnoud [Shojaee] for execution [and the execution was delayed], he lost ten pounds afterwards. When my case went for the execution, I was really afraid too. I couldn’t even eat.

Q: Saber, if the victim’s family reads this interview by any chance, what is your message to them?

Saber: I just want them to know that I was very young and immature in that incident, and what I did was completely inadvertant. Your son was lucky to have gone. I am the one who has stayed behind and has become miserable.

- Maryam Youshidzadeh/Hamshahri Monthly

Translation by: Siavosh J | Persian2English.com